Ben Pankonin 0:11
Welcome to gamification, by social insurance. We’re going to be talking about building engagement through competition today. So welcome back if you joined with our webinars before, you know the routine hashtag is social bank, and we’re social insurance. I’m Ben Pankaj, and I’m helping to host if you’ve heard me on here before, you know I try to host these and we we have a variety of different topics. Today’s topic is brought to us by Courtney haggard, who works here at social insurance is the content and client specialist. Welcome, Courtney.
Courtney Haggart 0:45
Good to be back. This is third time’s a charm. You keep inviting me back. So I think it’s a good sign. Well,
Ben Pankonin 0:50
you have done a great job and you work with so many clients on the front lines that I think you have a unique perspective because you keep getting some of their feedback. And hearing from them about the challenges that they’re facing. And also we’re going to talk a lot about contest and campaign design today, which is something I know you spend a lot of time talking to clients. Yes,
Courtney Haggart 1:11
yeah. No, that’s one of the main things I do. And I’m really excited to share what we have here today with our viewers. And just to dive into more of this idea of gamification, and why it’s been such a popular trend in the most recent years,
Ben Pankonin 1:25
well, awesome. And I know that you are a competitive person yourself. I have witnessed this in multiple social insurance activities. And for those of you who know me know that Ben is sneaky, competitive as well. So you know, I think it’s, it’s not just about being competitive when we think about gamification. It’s a lot about psychology. So we’re going to talk about a lot of different topics today. But we’re gonna kind of break those down a little bit. Courtney, what, what is gamification, I actually looked through we had a question just as we were getting started, which was literally what what is gamification? And like? Why should I know about it? So what? What is it?
Courtney Haggart 2:05
Yeah, well, gamification is an online marketing technique. It’s just a new way to encourage engagement with a product or a service or just your institution in general. And it takes elements of typical game playing like competition, rewards, rules, and things like that and applies it to your brand uniquely. So that’s really the gist of gamification. It’s kind of a harder concept to understand, especially when we throw it around so casually, but ya know, it’s taking the marketing world by storm, a lot of people are adopting this. And we’re here today to tell you more about how your brand can fit into that.
Ben Pankonin 2:48
Yeah, no, I appreciate that. And, you know, when we think of gamification, it can take on a lot of different forms. And we’re gonna pull some examples from some financial institutions across the country, but we’re also going to pull in some content from Other types of places that maybe we don’t always think of, as, you know, being focused on gamification. So one of the things we’re, we’re thinking extensively about is how do we think about gamification and sort of where do we see it today? So one of those would be in the area of apps like Starbucks, right? Starbucks does a phenomenal job of gamification. And they do it within their rewards and loyalty app. I actually think it is one of the best designed mobile app experiences. Regardless of the platform, like I think it is truly a well designed, well thought out psychology experiment that Starbucks has has mastered in many ways. That’s one of the reasons that it’s one of the most downloadable or downloaded apps in the country for sure. So we have other ways that we think about it. One of the original designers of if you’re familiar with the Netflix series abstract, if you’re doing marketing, you’re doing design and really care about it. This is a documentary you should absolutely check out. But they actually interview the original designer of the Nike fuelband, which was fantastic design when it came out. I didn’t have one. I had had a Fitbit at the time. But what they did is they developed this idea of closing rings, which those of you now wearing Apple watches are very familiar. They stole basically the exact same design. So I mean, you could call it research and development, but but essentially, Apple stole that design, from this concept of the Nike fuelband. And the interface designer of that really captured this idea that each day. I want to have people coming back to this experiment, but not only do I want them to coming back, I want them to do multiple things. So if you watch the experience with my Apple Watch, and you watch Ben’s commitment now that he’s Reaching sort of these middle ages where he needs to continue working out every day. What it’s also tracking is not just whether or not I stand up every hour, it’s also tracking do I move throughout the day? Oh, and then do I exercise for a certain number of minutes. So it’s tracking multiple things. And it’s, it’s incentivizing me to continue doing that. Also, then I have some competitive friends who want to, you know, sort of throw rocks at me and see if I can keep up with them. Now, you know, we also have these examples in banking, right? The the sort of, like Paramount one we hear the most about is the free checking offers, right? Yeah, the classic example of sign up and get a toaster. But you know, we’ve received a lots of different types of examples of giveaways. And so we’ll talk a little bit about that, too. So, now, Courtney, you’ve helped us break this down into three distinct categories today, one of them being that idea of competition, right. So how do we get up Get people’s competitive juices flowing. Yep.
Courtney Haggart 6:02
And I think one of the biggest drivers of engagement is that element of competition. I think it’s just subconsciously, people want to be able to not only get a reward, but to feel like they accomplished something that other people couldn’t. I think that’s a really big psychological factor when it comes to gamification, and I think that’s a really important thing to talk about today. As well as rewards, you know, what, what are they getting out of this experience? And just things to keep in mind rules of play? And, you know, what, what to you know, do when you’re can start constructing your own game? Yeah, yeah.
Ben Pankonin 6:40
So we’re gonna think about kind of how we put together a game, right? So so to borrow the, the metaphors, we’re going to be the game designer, right? And hopefully, we don’t have to eat some weird fruit at the end of that. Now when we think about creating a competition, one of the examples That I think of is, if you’ve never read the book Pitch Anything by Oren klaff, he gives us a few examples for how psychology works. And I will warn you, you don’t need to read Oren klaff book, just go look at his YouTube, it’ll take you an hour and it’s way better than his book. But in that he starts out with this idea that people chase that which is moving away from them. Right? We enjoy the chase in life, we want to pursue something to capture it, to feel that sense of that. We don’t always move towards the things that are moving towards us. If you don’t believe in this scenario, I was having a great chat with one of my banker friends from Ohio. And Jamie was mentioning to me that she’s getting a whole bunch of these phone calls. With long voicemail recordings on them. She’s like, seriously, it’s like a five minute recording. Have someone you know, trying to sell me their product? That is something that’s moving toward you, right? We don’t tend to buy things that are moving towards us. We buy things that are moving away from us. They seem elusive. Right? We know that if we don’t buy it, somebody else will. Right. According to you talked about it a little bit recently, you bought a car not that long ago?
Unknown Speaker 8:21
I did. Yes.
Ben Pankonin 8:22
And you moved very quickly. You’re decisive person anyway. But you moved really quickly on that car. Why?
Courtney Haggart 8:28
Because I had a very strong feeling it would not be there, even in a couple of hours. So yeah, I acted fast, because I knew other people would want this. And so I want to have it. I want this to be mine so that no one else can really reap the benefits of something that I want. There’s a limited quantity. So you just have to be decisive in those situations.
Ben Pankonin 8:51
Yeah. Yeah. And I appreciate that. I think that’s the that’s the right idea and the mentality that we go into offers, and this is why we think about things and week time constrain them. So if you haven’t seen some of the news this morning, one of the biggest things in the news this morning, Courtney, we have some dissenting opinions here. But one of the biggest things is the Shamrock. shake his back. Right, folks, you heard it here first, if you didn’t pay attention to the online news this morning, the Shamrock Shake is back. It’s been gone for a couple years. But McDonald’s is releasing it obviously, for just a short amount of time. But why do that? Why not keep the shampoo why not keep this culinary brilliance around for all time, Courtney? Why not?
Courtney Haggart 9:37
The culinary brilliance part is a little debatable, Ben, but it’s really just it’s the time that it’s available. St. Patrick’s days coming up. Green, you’re thinking of those things. And years ago, McDonald’s had this and it was a very successful campaign. It didn’t taste good. So they Oh no, he got rid of it. But they’re bringing it back because Even years later, whether or not the taste was good up for discussion, people were still talking about it. They were still saying, Hey, we remember when McDonald’s did this years ago, why don’t why don’t they do this anymore?
Ben Pankonin 10:13
Yeah. So we see this sort of trend in restaurants. And I think it’s a really fascinating example. Because in in banking, a lot of times, we don’t hold things back, right? We will say, Hey, we are a full service bank, we have all of these opportunities, and we do them all the time. We don’t constrain those things to a limited time period quite enough. There’s a reason why restaurants or places like that do that there’s a reason why we have taco Tuesdays, and why, you know, we have, you know, different examples of specials on a menu or limited times. And it’s because it allows us to cut through that noise, and allows us to cut through that noise because there’s one space in time in which I get that opportunity to say this message. You know, for those of us who work with nonprofits, you know, you know that there’s a reason why we do a capital campaign, we do it because we can say it’s a capital campaign, people know, it’s a one time opportunity to really take a look at that. And then it allows us to kind of move on to some other topic in the future. So this allows us to take something that’s very short and timely and make it in a specific time period. Now, employee involvement is another great way to talk about engagement. I know there’s some Twitter chat about it tomorrow, I was just thinking about that and responded to some tweets on it. But you do when we think about things like leaderboards, right, and volunteer activity. These are awesome opportunities to start to engage and see what employees are doing as far as gamification to you know, we see these with a lot of the banks we work with, and it’s it’s not always about a score, right? It’s it’s also about thinking like you You know, what’s the impact? And how do we include others? I also think one of the big factors in employee involvement is being able to message to our other staff and say, hey, it’s not just that, you know, there’s a few people that are involved in this, but we’re a bank that cares about this part of our community, the way we message that, to our staff across the board is really important.
Courtney Haggart 12:26
I think a great example as well, with employee involvement is taking something that you would regularly do and try it in a new way. An example of this is, you know, in the fall, a lot of banks will and financial institutions will collect cans for food banks, very classic thing that we do, but this year, one of our clients actually turned it into a competition between branches on who could collect the most, and there wasn’t even a prize involved. That was really just to have the bragging ability to say my branch did this and more employees here were so involved that we got this many donation. So there’s also ways that you can take something that you would do regularly each year and reimagine it for this new year for 2020.
Ben Pankonin 13:12
Yeah, yeah, well, and I think reminding our staff that this is something that we’re doing and we’re, some of them are going to be more or less competitive about those things. Sounds like you found a real winner there. You’d
Courtney Haggart 13:23
be surprised at who ends up being competitive about things as well. It’s not always who you’d expect.
Ben Pankonin 13:27
Yeah, that’s absolutely true. And I think that’s one of the beauties of employee involvement is that you have people who care about different causes, different reasons, different things that motivate them. And you know, we, we have a process on our even our payroll at the office that allows you to contribute to a nonprofit when you set up your payroll, and I was amazed when we had switched to that payroll mechanism, because one of our youngest employees was the first one to select that they wanted to contribute to a nonprofit and I thought Wow, like, that’s a really awesome thing to see. You know, as soon as we rolled it out, they were like, well, this is great. I get to get to do good things with this. You know, in their case as an intern, I thought that was a really neat way to see that kind of come together. Now, follower involvement. That reminds me, we had a question that came in here just a bit ago, which was from it was from Katie. And she asked about, how do we think about getting more followers with these sorts of gamification? So what do you usually talk to customers about when you say, We need more followers?
Courtney Haggart 14:40
Yeah, well, I think that’s just a really common goal to any any type of business that’s on social media. And when it comes down to it, your employees are really your biggest fan base to start with. You need to have a strong foundation to be able to build followers in the first place. So what I always tell our clients is that You know, if you’re looking to get followers look internally first, because if you’re not excited about what you’re doing internally, if your employees aren’t excited, you can’t expect the public to be. So I always put that down as a just a base foundation on how to build that and then extend that to the public.
Ben Pankonin 15:21
Yeah, no, you’re absolutely right. So, you know, we’ve we’ve chatted about these, you know, when we first started social insurance, one of the we had a larger bank in our market that I went to and said, You have far less likes than you do employees. So let’s do something about that. And, you know, fortunately, we got the opportunity to help them a little bit with that and they didn’t take it personally. And but you know, for many of us, what we kind of do is say, hey, how do we how do we engage them right? It’s not that we have to, you know, ask all our all of our employees Hey, go like us, but you know, having them apart That contest or campaign is an awesome way to invite them right like,
Courtney Haggart 16:04
or just to show them in the community on your page. A lot of times in the local communities, there’s a familiar face. So people are more likely to follow your brand when they’re seeing a face behind that. So another way just to highlight your employees, as well as that’s just one of the best ways to get the public’s attention. They’ll see someone Oh, this is my neighbor. I know him. I’m going to follow their brand.
Ben Pankonin 16:28
Yeah, yeah. No, I think it’s I think it’s a great way to start getting. The other thing that kicks off is we talk a lot about in these webinars, the the virality component, right? So what is it that makes a post more viral? And what happens is, its people who start liking it, right. Some of those people could be your employees, you should be your strongest advocates. But if they’re helping to provide that baseline of virality right away, or they’re liking posts, replying to some posts, now we have to make sure that they’re not trolling. Are posts. So every once in a while my wife will sort of mentioned that to me that I will respond back to one of her posts, and I tend to be a little bit snarky online. And so I did this a couple weeks ago and she said, Ben, you can’t troll me on Instagram. And I was like, No, it was kind of funny. Like, quite honestly, like, you have to admit it was funny. And eventually we had that laugh, but, you know, I had to admit that I was wrong. And she was right. And then we were all good, but like, you know, we have to think about how do we get, you know, sort of those core group of followers to to like and engage. Now, other examples, when we start thinking about, like, competition between branches. You talked about things like that cat food drive, you know, we’ve got awesome one here. That First National Bank threw out there, you know, bracket competitions. I know Tim’s going to give me a hard time for this one. But I love basketball season is right around the corner. And yes, his team’s probably in and mine is out. But hey, look You know, we all have our moments. For me that moment happened after ninth grade when they asked me to retire from basketball. But, you know, we all have those moments where we have to hang it up. You know, we have things like scavenger hunts. You know, we have some fun ones. I don’t know if we have any photos of them in here, but like, we’ve got some cool ones. You know that people are sort of like dropping different random things around town. Those are really fun. It’s fun to see some of them when they repeat those. I think one one of the things we forget about sometimes is repeating a contest can be a building thing, like we can actually get to a spot where people are expecting a contest, and then they’re already jumping into it. So it can it can start off with virality too.
Courtney Haggart 18:48
It’s kind of like the way with Starbucks and their pumpkin spice lattes. We know it’s only available for a short period of time, but we look forward to it every fall because we know that they’re going to roll it out any day. The same can be said for competitions and ongoing engagement. So you do want to have a time constraint on it you want, you know, that sense of urgency. But that doesn’t mean that this is a one and done thing. So that’s something to keep in mind when you’re thinking about gamification and what you want to do to involve your branches or your local community.
Ben Pankonin 19:20
Yeah, it also starts to organize our content, right? When we start thinking about timeframes. Sometimes we need a timeframe constraint on our content, right? So I know that from now until April 15, there’s a high likelihood that my customers are going to be paying more attention to their finances than any other time in the year. Right. I know that they’re going to be looking at specific elements, they have to go through those finances. I had to fill out a form this week in which I had needed to aggregate some of my accounts and look at those together. Those are great times to be reminding staff that hey, we know it’s painful to get these taxes done. But it allows that contest or campaign around that activity to really be focused in in context. So I think that context is really important. So engaging employees and your community, bring them around that common event or goal, your coordinate, we’ve said it so many times, but what you do in social media and the digital world is highly influenced by what you’re doing in the physical world. We’re doing a physical event, that’s going to be our best chance for great social media. Yes, exactly. Yep. Um, you know, changing elements to celebrate community, I think, you know, showing that it’s not just about dollars, it’s about impact. It’s about being involved in the community. Sometimes we need to shift the way we talk about them. I’m working a little bit with our local food bank on a on a campaign right now building a new building, all that kind of fun stuff. But part of what we’re talking about is how do we make a landmark in our community, and that’s something that we start to really do. Develop a process around and say, hey, how do we show people that these are the landmarks that are important in our community. And each one of our branches can represent that when we do the right marketing around it. So those are really fun. We’re going to talk a little bit about rewards. Now, we talked a little bit about the beginning, people chase that which is moving away from them. And then we also learn that people want what they can’t have. So again, our first principle was people chase that which is moving away from them. And people want what they can’t have. Now, we all know some of these examples of people want what they can’t have, right? You know, some of those are, you know, for a few of you in dating relationships, some of those might be that that car that you know, I really want this new Tesla SUV sort of thing. Maybe not the pickup I don’t know if I can go that far, but, but like the SUV sounds really cool. But I don’t think I can have it like, it’s that that’s out of my range at my house. That’s not gonna happen. But like, there’s a sense that you want something that is unattainable. And I think this is really where we roll into rewards, contests and campaigns to understand what is it that people want, that they perceive that they can’t have? So in a bank, right, it could be something like, you know, local discounts, it could be roadside assistance, it could be all of those things. There’s a number of great vendors that are really helping in this space, whether it’s, you know, something like, you know, buzzing from strategy Corp, or buzz points or, you know, kasasa, or all of those different ones that are helping you to develop a rewards and loyalty program. Those are great things to emphasize. What we’re going to talk about here a little bit is how do we sort of structure those rewards? and communicate about those. Because I think they’re really great opportunities for us to talk about how we engage those and and present some rewards. So one of them is, you know, your audience thinking about the chase, right? So again, if we’re chasing something that’s moving away from us, and we see value in it, you know, understanding that there’s a free gift and it ends at a certain timeframe,
Courtney Haggart 23:24
right? Having something available all the time is the killer of action and engagement. So making sure to put a time constraint or some type of constraint around a reward is very important.
Ben Pankonin 23:37
Yep. And there’s an art to how long to write like, if we put that up, hey, it’s only available for two days. Maybe I don’t get very many people to bite on it. But if I put it up for a month, or for a week, depending on what that item is, that might cause an action. Yeah, exactly. But yeah, changing that if I change that to a year, that magic goes away.
Courtney Haggart 23:58
It’s not memorable because there’s not that sense of urgency behind it,
Ben Pankonin 24:02
right? Absolutely. So we need that sense of urgency. And then we need things that are of value, right? So we, we think of things like, you know, hey, you could get better rewards, we’ve seen that trend. Some of you are, are dancing on either side of that debate, whether you’re charging for checking accounts and offering additional rewards to that, or you’re offering free checking accounts, and offering some sort of reward or promotion to get people started and going, you know, both sides of that debate are are baked into the sense of, we need rewards. So when we think about rewards, we want to expand demand by limiting the perception of availability. So we have to limit the timeframe that these things are available for. And then we will also want to make sure that it’s something that people feel like is unattainable in one way or another. Now, this also helps us To structure when we’re creating a game on social media, one of the things we talked about a lot of times is, if you’re giving away a prize, right? You want to create a prize. That is something that someone is probably not going to buy themself usually, but they would love to have. So
Courtney Haggart 25:18
Yeti coolers are a great example of this.
Ben Pankonin 25:20
Yeti coolers are great example. You know, trips or, you know, experiences are great examples of this. So oftentimes we’ll look for a unique experience that we’re not actually it’s not easy to find the dollar amount for it, right. So sometimes we’ll look at that. Hey, there’s a waterpark that’s close enough for a family to go to or there’s an evening stay, you know, or a dinner at a at a really special restaurant you might not have afforded that restaurant you might not, you know, choose to go there simply because of the price. It’s not that you could never afford It but you just might not prioritize that enough. Those are great opportunities that feel like, hey, it’s something that I see value in. Because it seems somewhat unattainable. You know, we’ve also seen some great examples of sports tickets that look like that. It’s not that we have to give away sports tickets every time. But when we highlight those, those are a great opportunity to pull people in and rally them around that event or location. If you happen to be one of the banks that are sponsoring, you know, an arena or event venue, that’s also a really great way to take that event venue. And, you know, boil that down and, and, you know, sort of give people a unique experience might be behind the scenes tour, or things like that. You know, we’ve seen some huge trends in our culture around things like culinary experiences. So it’s not just a don’t just think about dinner, but think about, you know, cooking Do you provide a couple with? We had some of these for Valentine’s Day where it was, Hey, could you provide a couple with like cooking lessons together? Right? It’s a unique experience you might not spend money on. But when it’s when it’s given as a promotion. We’ll see people really work hard for those kinds of things. It seems like it’s unaffordable, even though it’s maybe $200. So, those are that’s really debating on what are the types of contests that you might look at. I think those are really, really valuable. So then, people only valued that which they pay for, or I would argue invest in. So again, this these all come from Oren klaff, like he says, people chase that’s that’s wishes moving away from them. And people only value that which they pay for or invest in. What this means is when I say something about a place I make a recommendation. So for instance, last weekend was Valentine’s weekend, I took my wife to a restaurant called prairie plate. It was six miles on a gravel road to get to this restaurant. really unique place. But you know, it’s out in the middle of a country, old farmhouse kind of thing. And I’ve told several people about it, we had a great experience. But once I’ve told somebody, I have this, this thought in the back of my mind that says, are they going to like it? As much as we did? Are they going to be okay with that? And I hope so. But I don’t know for sure. Right? And then that’s part of what happens when we invest in something. I’ve now invested not just in in the dinner for two at this restaurant, but now I have a vested interest in telling others and I have a vested interest in pre plate being a successful restaurant because now I’ve told other people and I hope they have a good experience.
Courtney Haggart 29:00
When other people visit, they’ll base their experience on your recommendation to so it comes back on you.
Ben Pankonin 29:06
Right, right. Sometimes we forget when we do a, say a tele friend type of campaign or something like that in banking, sometimes we forget or lose sight of what happens when we make that recommendation. And there’s always something in the back of our mind that says, I really hope that they had the same experience with this bank as I did. I made a recommendation to one of the people at work who said, Hey, I need you I need to refi my mortgage. I said, Well, you know, you here’s some options for you, right? I happen to have some friends who are in the business. But immediately I’m going Hey, I know that these people can deliver on that experience. And that’s really important. I want to kind of separate out to Courtney, we thought we had this debate, a healthy debate about about fast food restaurants and how they do rewards points. So I’m going to throw back to a long time. time ago, when we used to compete for stamps. This sounds like a really old concept. It wasn’t really all that long ago in history. But subway used to do stamps, right? You remember those stamps, you’d sort of like bring in your card, and they would hand they would put a stamp on your card. This is back when subway. subway had a little bit different reputation at that time than it does today. But I would bring in, you know, my card. My office wasn’t very far from a subway and they would put stamps on my card until I finally got a free sub. Now their model other than Wednesdays, which was double stamp day, pretty exciting day at Subway, other than that, you know, is a pretty logical and linear path to rewards, right? You collect you know, you go by eight subs, you get one free, right? Pretty simple concept warrants
Courtney Haggart 30:57
were very cut and dry. You knew exactly what to expect. At the end of it,
Ben Pankonin 31:00
yeah, you got it. Right and then Panera came around and now that we’ve moved towards a digital rewards program, they broke this model, and they broke it in a big way. In that I have no idea what happens behind the scenes with Panera as rewards program, I get an email that says congrats you just got $2 off of a pick two item or you just got $1 off of a bakery item or Hey, congrats, you got a free soup or whatever it is. And I have no idea how it works. But it can be effective right? I think these two are the sort of extreme models between Hey, it’s a linear points opportunity with subway or it’s a random bread giving overhead trying
Courtney Haggart 31:48
to drive more behaviors from Panera
Ben Pankonin 31:51
right, you’re pointing to those towards the right example, right? It’s it’s about behavior, right? Pinero wants to see me when I’ve dropped off And I my perception is that they have some rather complex algorithms behind the scenes with Panera that are saying to them, Hey, you know what, we haven’t seen Ben in a while. We need to influence his behavior to get him back in here. They also gave me an interesting one last year in which they said it’s a free bagel for every day of I think it was February. So every day in February, you could come in and get a free bagel. I think I got one. But the reality was what they’re trying to do is get me in some sort of a habit forming routine. Also, they know that nobody can just eat a bagel, right?
Courtney Haggart 32:38
No, you have to get coffee. You’ve got to get your pastry item with it.
Ben Pankonin 32:43
Exactly like gonna need some cream cheese on that thing I’m gonna need Yeah, but they’re sort of influencing that behavior. And then I know you’re a Starbucks fan to. Starbucks comes in in the middle of that and says, What if we do both? Right? What if we help with points programs. So 400 or more points, gets you a free latte, but, or bakery item or things like that. But then why not influence that and get people to join a, what they’ll call it a dash or they have accelerated points, promotions programs, which helps you to influence that behavior as well. So really interesting when we see the nature of the way loyalty programs have changed in the digital era, because we’re able to put a lot more sophistication behind a loyalty program that we were able to do in those traditional ones. So one of those, you’ve got some short learning lessons for us. What should we do in the light of these programs?
Courtney Haggart 33:47
I think that the biggest thing to keep in mind is to understand what behaviors you’re trying to drive so what can you gamify whether that’s different events, whether you’re trying to increase checking accounts Opening social following whatever it is, before you embark on this journey of rewards of competition, you need to understand what behaviors you want your customers to come back with, and what you want them to do as a result of your game.
Ben Pankonin 34:18
Right? So we want to think about kind of, you know, how we how we measure some performance from these types of engagements. Right. So if it is, you know, like Katie asked earlier, if it’s a likes campaign, like, yes, we do want to measure how many new likes we got in a specific time for it. But we also want to measure things like, you know, how much traffic did we get, you know, if we know that we want to influence traffic to a landing page. You know, let’s set that up. And let’s create a game around it. Sometimes I think we think about gamification, and we think, ah, if only I could develop all of Paris loyalty program behind this scenes and know what people are doing every transaction and see all of that. And sometimes that gets in the way of our behavior, right? So some of the time, we have to sort of narrow that down and say, What if we just focused on how much traffic we can generate to an online account opening landing page. Maybe we drive some of it with paid traffic, maybe some of we drive through organic means, and then we try to get social media to amplify this traffic. So I think traffic is one of those really key where areas where we can start to measure things we can pay to move traffic, and you know, we can do that in any demographic. But I think those are really important. So if you don’t, and, and on that I had a question just a little bit ago that said, How does gamification work in a compliant industry? Fantastic question. You know, how does it work in a compliant industry? First of all, We got to get all of this approved. You know, we had a webinar not that long ago, which we talked about campaigns and giveaways and things like that. We definitely want to be thinking about, you know, making sure we’re not running a lottery for sure when we’re doing gamification. But you’ve got a few tips for us on other things we shouldn’t do.
Courtney Haggart 36:19
Yeah, so I think one of the biggest things not to get wrapped up in is you want engagement and not distraction. So you want to use gamification to enhance your brand, but you don’t want to make your brand solely about gamification. So that’s something to keep in mind and ways to do that are just to consider timely events. Maybe that’s that canned food drive where you create that competition that ends maybe that’s the free checking account, you get a gift and if you refer a friend, you both get this gift that ends within a month. So it’s really just remembering the value behind what what you’re gamifying and, you know, make it easy easily. Don’t confuse your participants, the more layers that you add on one, it’s harder to get approved. It’s harder to be compliant when you have a lot of rules going on a lot of loopholes to jump through. But you just need to clearly define your expectations and roles and rewards so that there’s no confusion that if I saw this online, I’d know exactly what you’re doing by one or two posts. So that’s something those are what you need to keep in mind whenever you’re considering gamifying any element of your institution.
Ben Pankonin 37:31
I know because I’ve been on the calls with you a lot of times, but you sort of talk people into, hey, we’ve got a lot of things we want to accomplish in a in a contest or gamification campaign, we got to boil it down into like, three, right, maybe two, right? Like, like we were just talking about a local contest, you were like, hey, it’s show up, get t shirt, right. Like, like, I can understand that. Like, I can communicate that to others and get the Go on board with that.
Courtney Haggart 38:01
Yeah. And the great thing about having so many ideas is that when you break it down into two, you’re leaving those other ideas for something that you can plan out and schedule for later in the year. So you’re creating that reason to keep customers coming back and to keep them excited about what your brand is going to do next.
Ben Pankonin 38:17
Yeah, I like that, you know, you know, I think when we have confusion, right, it’s, it’s the enemy of engagement. Right? You know, when we have confusion, people sort of go, I’m not really sure how I would engage. I’m not sure what I would do with this contest this campaign. So limiting the amount of steps like you said three or less is a huge factor. Now we we talked just a little bit about reviews, or some of those social sharing mechanisms. How do you see those working?
Courtney Haggart 38:55
Yeah, so we had talked earlier about this this morning, Ben, but Facebook See more and more often I’m going online and seeing somebody who I follow looking for recommendation somewhere. You know, at this point in my life, it’s usually Where can I get my windshield replaced? Give me recommendations or Where’s a good place to rent a house? Where Where should I go to consolidate my student loans? So I’m getting a lot of questions like that on my Facebook feed and having reviews available. and encouraging people that you have positive experiences with to leave a review is huge, because people are looking on social media, from their followers for recommendations getting that word of mouth. And that just trust is so important.
Ben Pankonin 39:41
Yeah, yeah. No, I completely agree with you. And you know, oftentimes that trust is is in with a stranger right. So what happens is when we talked about this at the beginning of this section, we talked about you people only value that which they invest in, right or So oftentimes what they’re valuing are things like spending some time on next door. You know, as quirky and weird as I have learned, my neighbors are next door. It also really unites that part of the community, in a way, and I’ve seen it in our neighborhood where there’s been a lively debate about the financial institutions in which they’re a part of, that’s a great place to be, and to be aware of is going on in your community. But what we want to do also, when we create a gamification campaign is provide those ways that enhance our brand. So when someone in my community says, Hey, I bank at this bank, because they care about their community, or because they do this, I want my customers to be able to say, Here’s why. You know, I know that they did this specifically for this nonprofit, or I know that they did that. For other people in the community, or I know they helped this business to be on the map, when it mattered most to them. All of those are really impactful ways. But we have to, we have to shorten those stories A lot of times, like you said, we’ve got to shorten it to three steps. They care because